Happy Monday, Sanderfans! It’s time, once more, for another Wind and Truth preview chapter discussion! Last week saw more of Szeth’s flashback! It’s so interesting, and heart-wrenching, to observe young Szeth and how he’s an absolutely different person than the Szeth we know. But it’s kind of cool how the flashbacks are unfolding through Szeth telling Kaladin of his childhood. What do you think of the flashbacks so far, and how they’re being presented, Sanderfans? We also got to witness Shallan charging into a room full of Ghostbloods while wearing Shardplate and wielding both a Shardblade and Shardshield—which is where we pick up the story this week! Today, we’re discussing chapters 29 and 30… so let’s dive in and see what Lyndsey, Drew, and myself have to say about these two chapters!
Oh, and be sure to check out the social media section at the end of the article to see if we spotlighted one of your comments!
Note that this post will possibly (likely) contain full Cosmere spoilers, so beware if you aren’t caught up on all Cosmere content. And please remember, when posting or commenting about these preview chapters on social media, follow your platform’s spoiler rules. Your comments here, however, don’t need to be spoiler-tagged, so feel free to comment as you will down below!
Paige’s Summary and Commentary
Chapter 28 is titled “Secret Handshakes” and opens with Shallan’s POV. She’s laying on the floor in the room that had recently been filled with Ghostbloods, gaping at the sudden disappearance of Mraize and Iyatil. Then she surmises that one of them must be an Elsecaller and they’ve just vanished into Shadesmar. Her crew rushes in; Darcira goes to her and pulls out the bolt at Shallan’s request. Once she feels that all of the anti-Stormlight has left her system, she breathes in some Stormlight and she heals. It’s nice to know that Pattern was happy she didn’t die without him there. He wants to be there when she dies because that’s what friends do for each other. I adore Pattern. He makes me laugh.
She takes a peek into Shadesmar and sees three people in a boat heading toward the Oathgate. Mraize and Iyatil had been prepared to flee, but also had to leave everything in their hideout behind. Shallan is happy to have captured Iyatil’s trophies, at least. She pulls back from looking into Shadesmar and decides not to take on the Ghostbloods alone. Knowing they have Radiant powers is enough to sway her decision. Though she does have an idea of who to ask for help. Maybe Dalinar? Renarin? Who do you think she’s going to go to, Sanderfans?
POV shift!
Next we see Lift and Gavinor, sitting outside the room where Dalinar, Navani, and Wit are meeting with Sebarial and Aladar. Gav is feeling down and Lift does her best to cheer him up. Wyndle is there, of course, and Lift calls to the Sibling to ask them questions, including if they’ve seen her red chicken. They haven’t. Gav asks if his grandparents want him, or are sad that they have to take care of him. ::owie feelings:: Lift ogles first Sigzil and then Drehy. Then she says “shit,” thus teaching Gav to swear. She also comforts him when he talks of his mother giving him to the Voidspren to torture and kill him. ::more owie feelings::
Gav talks of his father, who tried to save him but who was killed by the traitor Vyre. This surprised me… why would Gav know him as Vyre when everyone there refers to him as Moash? He says that he’ll kill everyone who ever hurt his father. He says he’ll kill them with a Shardblade and then cut them into tiny pieces. Lift says she’ll help because she feels as though he just needs someone to commiserate with and not to scold him. Gav is only five and just wants to play swords with Grampa, but I feel like there’s been a little too much swordplay in this little guy’s life. I know he went through hell with his mother, and with watching his father die… but I feel he could use a little Kaladin therapy rather than playing swords!
Dalinar and Navani come out of their meeting and Gav, again, asks to play swords. Dalinar begs off but Navani invites Gav to ride the lift with them. After he goes, Lift gets up and, though she was forbidden to sneak into the meeting, she says she’s going to follow them. Let’s see if she can sneak into another of Dalinar’s meetings!
Chapter 30 is titled “Not Alone” and it’s our first Renarin POV so far! He thinks of how he misses the way the tower used to be before the Sibling awoke. He doesn’t like how humid it is down in the lavis fields, though it’s more temperate nearer to the tower. He’s watching Rlain, who is talking to some humans about the crops and is joined by Drehy, who brings a message from Navani and who notices Renarin’s scrutiny of Rlain.
Drehy asks Renarin if he wants to talk about it, which nearly sends poor Renarin into a panic because he doesn’t know what “it” is. Then Drehy saves him by mentioning the way Renarin looks at Rlain. Renarin asks if it’s obvious and Drehy tells him that you learn to watch for guys who watch other guys, then reassures him that he’s there if Renarin wants to talk about it. It’s incredibly sweet, I think, that Drehy is offering answers to whatever questions that Renarin might have. Renarin is worried that Rlain might prefer women and even says that Rlain isn’t even human. Drehy basically says that he’s still a person and Renarin realizes that, despite his differences, Bridge Four still accepts him as one of them… as a person. It’s quite a touching moment.
Then Drehy departs and Rlain enters an unpleasant vision.
POV shift!
Rlain thinks about how he feels more himself in warform, and with Tumi as his spren, feels even more as he should. Then he notices Renarin “encased in a shimmering distortion in the air.” He realises that the humans won’t see it and asks Tumi if it’s one of Renarin’s visions.
Rlain joins Renarin in the vision, and this seems to make Renarin very happy; he feels he’s no longer alone with the visions if Rlain can see them, too. They study the windows in the vision, which show Renarin on a thrown, surrounded by his childhood possessions. Rlain notes that Renarin appears to be wearing singer clothing in the vision. Renarin reminds him that the visions can lie and Rlain questions their validity at all, if they can lie. One window also depicts the Everstorm, which Rlain finds odd as it had just passed.
Next they see Dalinar, standing at the edge of a cliff in front of a glowing, golden figure, who we must assume is Odium, yes? Renarin recognizes it as the first vision Dalinar was taken into. So I guess, not Odium.
The next window shows a green field where twelve people stand, and Renarin says he feels peace when looking at the scene. Here Renarin tries to hum to Confusion, much as he had tried to do moments before.
Then the last window, which depicts a femalen singer, just her face, and then she moves. Though Rlain and Renarin don’t know it, they’re looking at Mishram, who is furious, as she was when Shallan saw her in the bead ocean. Mishram seems to be trying to come out of the window.
Renarin screamed as the windows to the left and right shattered, exposing a dark wasteland. New windows grew up like vines, crystallizing and exploding, leaving jagged stumps—but before they broke, Rlain could pick out images. Burning cities. Broken bodies.
Above it all a rising Rhythm of Agony, with the femalen singer’s words echoing to the sound. I will break it. I will break IT ALL.
Yeah… that’s not terrifying at all.
Renarin pulls Rlain from the vision and they both collapse onto the ground. Renarin says that was a new thing to see in a vision, but that there is always something new. And that’s how Shallan finds them, seemingly lounging about, taking it easy. She announces she needs help, and that it involves people who are trying to find Ba-ado-Mishram.
Mishram. Yes, Rlain did know that name. She had ruled the singers long ago—a spren who had wanted to perpetuate the fighting after the Fused left. The one who had been determined to exterminate humankind, escalating the war.
She was the reason Rlain’s people had abandoned their forms and left. She was the queen of the gods they had forsaken.
And Rlain realizes that’s who they had probably just seen in the last vision.
Whew… that was an intense chapter, don’t you all think? Mishram is truly terrifying, and everyone just wants to go find her? I’ll pass, thanks! What do you think about the Rlain POV, Sanderfans? I think it’s pretty cool—we don’t get enough of him and it’s nice to see things from his perspective. At the same time, we don’t really see enough from Renarin’s perspective, either, and I wonder if we’ll start seeing more of both going forward… I was quite pleased about the Lift POV, as well, and hope we get to see more of her, too!
Lyndsey’s Commentary
I’ll be saving my comments on the snippets of The Way of Kings for the end of the part, once we see them all and get an idea of how they all fit together.
Chapter 29’s arch Herald is Vedeledev (Vedel), the patron of the Edgedancers. Her attributes are Loving/ Healing and her role is Healer. It’s pretty obvious as to why she’s here, as not only is this chapter primarily a Lift POV, but Lift is acting in accordance to her order’s Ideals to a T.
Chapter 30’s arch is Palah (Paliah), the patron of the Truthwatchers. Her attributes are Learned/Giving and her role is Scholar. Again, this one seems pretty obvious as both Rlain and Renarin are Truthwatchers, and we see an example of their powers in full force.
Shallan
Darcira, we both know my ego is big enough to count for between two and four people, depending on the day and my mood.
You know, it’s really nice to see Shallan’s self-deprecating humor. She recognizes that she has… shall we say issues, and uses them to make light of herself and put others at ease.
Lift
Lift had learned that sometimes to listen—and really hear people—you also had to be there when they didn’t talk.
She’s always been deceptively wise for her age, probably due to the trauma she’s endured. She’s also a very true-to-form Edgedancer. The Third ideal of the Edgedancers is “I will listen to those who have been ignored.”
Better, soon Drehy flew in to give a report. And Damnation, did he need a uniform that tight? Lift leaned to the side, so she could see better when he bent over the table with the maps.
Well, someone’s hit puberty for sure now. It’s nice to see Lift maturing, considering her previous wish to the Nightwatcher in Edgedancer (which, if you don’t recall, was “not to change”).
“You’ve got a place now,” she said. “Remember.”
He nodded. He’d need more reminders. Just like she did sometimes.
My heart absolutely aches for these two.
How can you not want to grow up,” Wyndle said, “and still spend half your days ogling men? Don’t you see the contradiction?
“No,” she said. “Don’t be stupid.”
“But your interest in men is obviously a maifestation of your advancement toward adulthood. You don’t seem to mind that, but you hate the secondary sex characteristics manifesting—”
I don’t think this has anything to do with gender dysphoria and has more to do with her fear of changing. Change is scary, especially to a child, so it makes sense that she’s trying to ignore the physical signs of her puberty while embracing the emotional side. Psychological changes are harder to ignore and suppress, after all.
Gavinor
Do you think Grampa and Gram… want me? Are they sad they have to take care of me?
Speaking of trauma… Oh, this poor, poor child. Not only was he held captive by his mother and tortured by spren for god knows how long, he then had to watch his own father be killed right in front of him (obligatory f*** Moash). I’m glad that he’s found a friend in Lift, because goodness knows this kid could use a friend, and particularly one who’s willing to listen to him and can sympathize with a little of what he’s been through.
I’m gonna find everyone who hurt my father, and I’m going to kill them. I’m gonna make their eyes burn out and then, when they’re dead, I’ll chop them to pieces.
Okay, well… you can’t really blame him. He’s still young enough to not understand the intricacies of warfare, and even if he was mature, there are adults who would say the exact same thing. Grief makes people think and do terrible things, especially when that grief is mixed with justifiable anger.
Rlain
Although people side-eyed him, although he’d been called a shellhead, he was here making certain the very people who distrusted him wouldn’t starve.
Rlain’s too good for the Alethi, I swear.
Renarin
It was a challenge sometimes, figuring out what people meant or wanted from him—and having another perspective, no matter how alien, was helpful.
Let this serve as your reminder that Renarin is on the autistism spectrum, as confirmed by Sanderson.
“The way you look at Rlain,” Drehy said in response to Renarin’s apparent confusion.
“Oh, that,” Renarin said, relaxing. It was an embarrassing topic, but at least now he knew what the topic was. “Is it… um… obvious?”
::confetti:: Yay! The ship has canonically sailed! (Context: Brandon had confirmed this in interviews and such for quite a while, but it’s never truly canon until it appears on the page.) I’m so happy to see this relationship starting in earnest and where it might potentially go. I think these two complement one another nicely, personality-wise. And Drehy’s discussion with Renarin on the subject is utter perfection. He’s being cognizant of Renarin’s needs in terms of both conversation and physicality, he’s providing a listening ear without judgment… the Windrunners really are stepping up into their roles as therapists as a whole. I guess Kaladin’s a good influence on them.
Renarin/Rlain
Rlain respected the other members of Bridge Four, Kaladin in particular, but there was something special about Renarin. When Rlain had been alone, rejected by the spren, Renarin had been the one to comfort him.
OoooooOOooooo he liiiiiiiikes him too!
Rlain hummed to Confusion. And Renarin, strangely, did as well? Or he tried. He glanced at Rlain and tried to imitate his humming. Renarin’s attempt was off-rhythm and too loud, like a child sounding out a word that was too big for them. But… Rlain had never heard a human even try before.
He’s trying to communicate the way Rlain does! A wonderful first step towards possibly initiating a relationship.
“I wanted a spren,” Rlain said. “I asked for it.”
I do love that they have the same kind of spren, so they can bond over this shared experience.
Kaladin/Syl
“I say it’s better to think of everyone as people. Human. Listener. Spren. All people. Even if some of them glow and are annoying.”
I just wanted to point out this little tidbit from Drehy, on the chance that it’s further justification of a potential Kal/Syl pairing.
Drew’s Commentary: Invested Arts & Theories
That had been […] them transferring to Shadesmar.
To lead off, Shallan identifies the action of Mraize and Iyatil as using Transportation, moving to the Cognitive Realm. This still leaves a question of which one used Transportation, and which Order they belong to—Elsecallers or Willshapers. We know that Sja-anat has Enlightened mistspren in the past, as well as inkspren such as those at the Kholinar Oathgate, so it’s very possible there are more Enlightened inkspren for Mraize and/or Iyatil to have bonded.
Another note of interest here, as Shallan uses her abilities as a Lightweaver to look into Shadesmar. She wonders whether her double bond to Pattern and Testament is what allowed her to fully enter Shadesmar back in The Way of Kings, in Kharbranth—but I’m not certain that timeline really fits. At the time, Pattern was only initially interested in her, not fully bonded. Perhaps, as with Bondsmiths, some of the rules have changed when it comes to Lightweavers.
And if so… Hoid may have just gained the ability to enter Shadesmar at will. I think he’d be very glad to have that particular ability, given his history of worldhopping and how annoyed he’s been at the state of travel between the Realms.
But let’s talk about anti-Light for a second here.
“I couldn’t afford to let it hit the armor—don’t know what it will do to the spren.”
Shallan dismisses her Plate and Cryptics, for fear of what would happen when Iyatil shoots the anti-Stormlight bolt. We’ve obviously seen anti-Light like this kill an honorspren, but it’s worth noting that Phendorana was not physically manifested as a weapon/metal at the time. Similarly, we haven’t seen anti-Light directly interact with Shardplate of any variety.
So: Would the anti-Light bolt have been deflected by either Shallan’s Plate or the Testament shield? If the head of the bolt simply bounced off the Shardplate or shield, would that contact be enough time to fully destroy the spren? I suspect that the state of the Investiture wouldn’t matter, and that the spren would be grievously wounded if not killed outright, depending on what kind of contact occurred.
But moving on to the first POVs of the book for Renarin and Rlain! While there’s a whole bunch of character development stuff here, which Lyn and Paige have already gone over, this scene is also interesting for both Investiture and theory reasons. As all Wheel of Time fans know, any time you have a vision of the future or prophecy at hand, it’s something to pay attention to.
The window depicted Renarin sitting on a throne. He wore some kind of archaic outfit, a little like the fencing attire people wore on the Alethi training grounds, with the skirts.
Given Renarin’s familial duties, and how he starts this chapter thinking about the hopes his family has for him, it’s no surprise that one of the visions indicates he could find himself on a throne. But the singer clothing? And it being in Kholinar, and in his own room? The loophole in the contract with Odium means that territories can change sooner than people assumed—but it would be one heck of a twist if the coalition managed to retake Alethkar before the tenth day.
On the other hand, this could be entirely metaphorical. Renarin is struggling with self-acceptance and understanding, as well as his feelings toward Rlain. Sitting regal on a throne in his childhood room, attired like Rlain’s people, could also indicate self-mastery. The vision is just vague enough to open up all sorts of possibilities.
The next two windows, showing the Everstorm and the vision we know so well from Dalinar, really feel like some Spiritual Realm timey-wimey stuff. They’ve already happened, but they’ll happen again—maybe. And Dalinar is about to head into the Spiritual Realm:
“The Bondsmith sees backward. Always, his eyes are toward what happened.”
This book is promising so many answers to ancient mysteries, to reveal long-held secrets.
The fourth window was, strangely, a bright green field with distant figures standing in it. […] He counted… twelve?
This one, emanating peace, is enticing. The green field sounds like Shinovar, with grass that doesn’t flee. But twelve people? That’s a strange number to be highlighted in a Stormlight book, where nine and ten are the prevailing Important Numbers. Even sixteen would make more sense. And they seem to be representative of many of the different cultures and races across Roshar:
“They’re all human, I think. This one might be a Horneater, and this one Makabaki…And this one—what are those humans with the blue skin?”
Maybe these are the Stone Shamans, with Szeth and Kaladin? Ten, one for each of the monasteries, and recruited from across Roshar? The Shin have been so secretive for all this time, but despite that the Stone Shamans have held a certain aura. Carrying the Honorblades is a big deal, after all.
If Kaladin and Szeth could band together with them all, unravel the insanity of Ishar, and cleanse Shinovar…that could be the peace Renarin and Rlain are feeling.
And finally, most ominously:
A simple face with intricate patterns, black and red swirling. A singer, femalen, against a black background, etched in glass. Staring at him.
It sure seems like Ba-Ado-Mishram is resting unquietly in her prison, eh?
Fan Theories
Not a fully fledged theory, but a comment we got a kick out of: Lofty! on Discord said, “It was a rock that started Szeth’s problems, and hopefully it will be Rock who paves a way to end it.”
Over on Reactor, Lock says, “I wonder if using the capitalised words “Stone”, “Winds”, and “Nights” in the first three paragraphs was intentional or if I’m just going crazy trying to find patterns and foreshadowing” and “the coincidence of using all of them in ways that they gramatically makes sense with capitals within a hundred words? And specifically the three Old Magic spren mentioned together like 5 chapters ago? I am probably insane, but it is weird if it was accidental. (I assume at least the Wind mention is intentional because it’s been associated with Szeth before).”
And Stoneward has theories about both Kaladin and Adolin: “I have a crazy theory that is kind of proved by this whole book so far. When I finished book four, I thought that Kaladin would go to Shinovar and become Honor. I know it is kind of hyping up dalinar, but I do not think it is him. Kaladin fulfills the vessel of honor much better than dalinar. He is called son of tanavast by the stormfather. He is literally sacrificing himself to help save everyone else. That is honorable. Second crazy theory. Adolin is going to be Odium’s champion. His passionate anger shown in the duels against other shardbearers, and his murdering of Sadeas shows his rage. He also in book four was angry at his father, and was rebelling against everyone else. His anger against Dalinar really shows this. He hates his father, up to the point of irrationality. I also think that Dalinar is going to lose the contest to Adolin. Odium was trying to find a person who would cause a big blow morally, and that will be Adolin. I am excited for all of your thoughts.”
Finally, Avlost17 talks about Taln: “I wonder if there could be some link to whatever is darkening Taln’s shaman house and his diminished mental capacity. So we’ve seen small lucid moments from him. Maybe it’s not just from millenia of torture.”
We’ll be keeping an eye on the comment sections of posts about this article on various social media platforms and may include some of your comments/speculation (with attribution) on future weeks’ articles! Keep the conversation going, and PLEASE remember to spoiler-tag your comments on social media to help preserve the surprise for those who choose to wait for the full release. See you next Monday with chapters 31 and 32!
First chapter where Renarin talks to Rlain: “Alone Together”
This chapter: “Not Alone”
Awww!
I needed some help because the sweetness in that chapter gave me diabetic shock!
Sooooo, Gav and Lift are going to be stuck in the spiritual realm?
or what is going to happen here?
I wasn‘t worried about Gav being Odium‘s champion before, but this makes it terrifyingly possible… just imagine, Gav tagging along to the Spiritual Realm, then getting lost and stuck there for many decades, coming back a grown man ready to finally play swords with Grampa who abandoned him so often.
Damn, that’s actually an insanely solid theory, wow. I’ve never really bought into the gav champion theory any more than Adolin, especially since its more of a loophole, only real evidence is it ties into the death rattle about killing the suckling babe
But yeah that would work
Ive mostly been thinking the time dilation will remove Dalinar for the 10 year time skip so they have to cope without him..
The first vision is the one we’ve seen, definitely not odium, it’s honor speaking to him on the cliff when all the other stars are blinking out and he says this is what we fight.
Oh, lift is definitely sneaking into the spiritual realm
She, at least, may have Cultivation at her back.
The other people don’t really fit, but the blue person in the field kinda sounds like an honorspren that Ishar successfully brought into the physical realm
It could possibly be Syl
Also, i guess I’m assuming that some of what R and R saw are things for the second arc of SA?
And, we did see Dalinar interact with Odium more than once (at least once) in the vision of the dissipating Kholinar, so while R is certain they see the future, I figured that this was the past vision?
Looks like a bit of a retcon, Lift asking the Sibling if theyve seen the red chicken, but at the end of RoW, Dalinar says Lift has “Taken to walking around with a red chicken”.
I mean, the fact shes talking about it means she just might have lost it, its been a day and a half.
It could be that in the last few days Lift lost it again.
To speak of ancient days, before the humans arrived and before Honor & Cultivation, Rlain attunes the Rhythm of Winds
I noticed that one too. The ancient spren of Adonalsium are going to play a big role here
Well, this blue-ish person in the vision may be of that folk living far in the ocean, known from Wit’s tale in WoK or interlude of one of the Natanatans(?) preparing for guests from there…
Seems like Mishram is heavily connected to Fortune. Shallan sees her right after Kelek reveals that Shallan has been using Fortune in her drawings. Then Rlain sees her when literally in a vision of the future. Not sure what this means, just food for thought. Might not just be Odium messing with Renarin’s visions
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Heads up: Lyndsey’s commentary used the term “gender dysmorphia”, which is not the correct term. This conflates gender dysphoria, the term for describing various forms of unease with one’s own various gendered traits, and dysmorphia, a completely different condition. The terms are similar sounding, so it’s a common mistake but many anti-trans people specifically conflate the two to create the idea that gender affirmative treatment is actually harmful.
Thank you for the clarification–we’ve updated that section!
Drew, in RoW raysium in the dagger wasn’t harmed by contact with, or indeed by conducting anti-Voidlight. I really don’t see why the same shouldn’t be the case for the spren in metallic phase, particularly since they don’t even consist of only, or in the case of Cryptics and creationspren even predominantly, from Honor’s investiture. IMHO, Shallan over-reacted and her spren wouldn’t have been harmed, so long as they didn’t get dismissed or attempted to change shape.
From Doylist PoV, it makes no sense to de-power Radiants to such a degree when they are supposed to remain relevant and dangerous in the future of the cosmere.
Mind, I never liked that noob Radiants dominated the vastly more experienced and numerically superior Fused for the last 2 books, but nerfing them so hard would be an over-correction, IMHO. Anti-stormlight is going to be dangerous enough for un-plated Radiants.
Also, as someone noticed elsewhere – when Shallan looked into Shadesmar, where were the enlightened spren? Shouldn’t it have been 5 figures in that boat?
And Sanderson called attention to Vasher’s disappearance and it’s timing, hm… Which provides further support for my theory that he was the one who made anti-stormlight for the Ghostbloods. I wonder if one of the captured members is going to reveal where he is being kept.
P.S. In the vision of the 12 people, if Kaladin and Syl are among them, shouldn’t R&R have recognised them? I am also thrown by the presence of a Horneater – surely that person could be neither a Herald, nor a Shin Stone Shaman? Could the blue woman be a personification of the Wind instead? Also, I thought that the Siah Aimians were bright blue?
There are a number of signs that suggest Vasher got captured by GhostBloods, yes (including the ability to look for high concentrations of Investiture), but I am not sure they are enough to fully outweigh the part where Vasher is a badass fighter. Perhaps the GB had a lot of intel and could spring a targeted trap on him, I suppose.
the stain glass figures might just be too blurry to recognize.
I was going to say, they’re stained glass pictures, they might be too stylized to identify. Then I thought about how stylized they’d have to be for *Kaladin* to look like Just Some Guy. Especially if he’s still wearing his uniform. I think you might have a point.
All this talk about anti-Stormlight and explosions and stuff, made me realize that people here are on the verge of developing a nuclear weapon, and it might be used to get an advantage or even cease all battles until the contest. That’d be an interesting thing to have around in the next five books, especially when they are potentially facing off-worlder threats.
Well…this was a plot point in The Lost Metal where they did split a god metal…and it comes off very much like nuclear fission.
I know, and especially to guard against the Ghostbloods (who originated on Scadrial which has advanced technology), because they are sure gonna do some bad stuff
Yeah, Dalinar basically said it already when speaking about fighting threats from other worlds, and about weapons that can level cities and destroy thousands at a time on a battlefield.
Sounds like the Second Arc is gonna enter into next generational warfare.
This might be crazy….but here me out:
Cultivation has set up at least two different people to take up Shards of Adonalsium:
-Taravangian we know for sure as Odium
-Dalinar, from the fact that she tampered with his Spirit Web and then all but told him to go and take the power of Honor
….could it be she set up a third to take HER place? Perhaps, someone who she Invested, for reason unknown, with Lifelight?
So far we know of only 3 people who saw Cultivation herself, and the third one is Lift. Perhaps Koravellium Avast has tired of her station and longs to set up her replacement?
Have to admit, Lift would be a wild Shard.
I was actually having the same thought about whether Cultivation might be setting up someone to take up her own shard a couple weeks ago. And I don’t see any other candidates for people getting set up to do that than Lift.
She did ask the Night Mother to not change, seems fitting.
My comments to Chapter 29
· Re the epigraph. Wise words. The world would be a better place if more people adhered to that statement, myself included. I have made such blanket assertions; sometimes more nuisance was probably needed on my part.
· That is Shallan. Commenting to herself that it was nice that she did not explode when she finally Invested Stormlight after anti-Light left her.
· Maybe it is because the 2nd part of Chapter 29 is a Lift POV and the chapter icon was Lift’s, but I think Shallan will ask Shallan for whom she will go to for help. I doubt it will be Jasnah or Venli. Even though Shallan and Jasnah are on good terms as of this point (at least I think they are), I am not sure Shallan would go this route. If she seeks out Jasnah’s help, Shallan knows Jasnah’s personality is the type that Jasnah will eventually take charge of the mission. Whether she does so on purpose or whether due to Jasnah’s force of personality, others (including Shallan) will defer to Jasnah. As for Venli, Shallan has not had any interactions with Venli. Also, I think Venli will remain with the rest of the Listeners and Leshwi and Leshwi’s companions.
· @paige. I think Moash was around the palace when Gav was being tortured by Voidspren. At that time, Moash would have been referred to by Vyre. He heard the name when Humans, Singers, Regals and/or Fused spoke to Vyre.
· @paige. I am surprised you did not comment upon Lift hearing Gav ask Navani what “shit” means. Those were a funny few lines.
Moash was named Vyre after the end of Oathbringer upon killing Jezrian, after Gavinor was rescued by Kaladin.
He probably heard the name later, from Kaladin’s reports or Lift telling him or something.
My comments to Chapter 30
Chapter 30
· I like the Renarin and Rlain chapter.
· The epigraph is ironic. Nohadan said he fears a child with a weapon the child cannot lift as much as Nohadon fears the mind of a man who does not think. Yet, we have seen the child who was unable to lift a weapon grow up to be a man who was the lynchpin for Dalinar killing Evi. Does that mean one of the protagonists (Dalinar, perhaps) should fear the mind of a man who previously did not think clearly but now does (TOdium, perhaps).
· Ok. I was wrong. Looks like the help Shallan sought is Renarin and Rlain.
· I prefer the modern Alethi takama. I do not have the body to wear the ancient takama. Wearing the ancient style would expose my gut.
I think that Renarin’s vision of Shinovar is nine of the ten Heralds (with Taln missing), plus Kaladin, Syl, and Szeth. I’m guessing that Syl is somehow able to manifest fully in the physical realm. I’m wondering if the Contest in Shinovar and it’s cleansing is somehow separate from the contract involved in Dalinar’s contest. Perhaps Dalinar loses while Kal and Szeth win, leaving Shinovar the only place on Roshar that is safe from Odium. Would also explain Wit’s forewarning/shadowing – telling Kaladin that he won’t be returning to help Dalinar with his contest. Why return if the only safe place left is Shinovar? Will the rest of our cast also seek refuge in Shinovar?
Wasn’t it said that Shinovar was the land that the humans brought with them from their original planet (Ashyn)? If so, would this mean that it technically isn’t part of Roshar (as in not native to Roshar) and is therefore not eligible to be part of the contract that Dalinar made with Odium?
Also, the in world author of Knights of Wind and Truth mentioned that the Heralds and the Wind left Roshar, and that spren are less common. What if the in world author also sees Shinovar as distinct from the rest of Roshar, given it’s foreign origin? Perhaps all we will be left with at the end of this book will be Shinovar.
Jezrien is already gone, so with Taln missing you’ll have 8 left.
You right! I forgot about that. Would make sense then that Taln would actually be part of the vision and part of the Contest involving the cleansing of Shinovar – assuming that is what this vision is depicting.
I respect that Drehy is respecting boundaries. I do. I am also quite convinced that he knows what’s up, and will either do something to push our boys along or be demonstrably unsurprised should they get together.
“I say it’s better to think of everyone as people. Human. Listener. Spren. All people. Even if some of them glow and are annoying.” This is not the first time this topic has been raised, and I am glad that the characters accept each other as they are. Even if they differ in appearance, status, orientation, origin, etc. So I think this line fits Syl perfectly and also the potential romantic relationship between Kaladin and Syl, which I’m really looking forward to seeing develop. I hope they have sweet moments like Rlain and Renarin had in their chapter. Soft and tender.
Based on the description of the blue character, and how the skin was too blue for any human race, I thought about Syl.
Also, I am curious if anti light, which is a gas and tied to the spiritual realm, will interact with physical manifestations of investiture like shardblades or shardplate. Guess we will read and find out, but could anti investiture have to be in the same form, solid, liquid, gas, to interact with investiture? It would be an interesting limitation if so.
Fan Theory Time! A quick re look at coppermind shows 11 people w/ shards… Harmony is weird… they seem to be mostly humans. Perhaps the 12 seen in the vision are the 11 remaining people w/ shards and a reborn honor?
This is kind of out there but it’s a fun thought! When discussing the source of Renarin’s visions, Glys mentions a swelling or maybe a crescendo in the rhythms of Roshar, followed by a some talk of the old gods from before the Shards showed up on the planet. Maybe the visions are how Stone or one of the other old powers communicate with Renarin? Might Rlain or his spren notice a similar swell in the rhythm of Roshar when the Wind is whispering to Kaladin?
Even more troubling than pondering what would happen if anti-stormlight is indeed harmful to spren mainfested as a weapon or plate was the idea of it coming into contact with stormlight during healing inside a person’s body. The ‘anti-stormlight’ injection weapon was truly devious!
Because the visions are so vague I find it more fun to just let them play out, but I’m really interested in the bondsmith ‘looking back’ and what we might learn about the past.
Renarin trying to hum a rhythm was adorable.
Some assorted thoughts (I have a couple others that might need to be fleshed
out more).
Any theories on how we got wrong-color painspren? I am not sure that the anti-light seems like a plausible cause for that unless it has somehow wounded them badly and they are on their way to die.
This calls to mind the Edgedancer’s third ideal “I will listen to those who have been ignored”, which has some rather ominous implications about Gav being ignored and perhaps, just perhaps, pushing the “Odium’s champion” theory.
Given the focus that was given to Syl’s appearance and how it was malleable with effort but reverted to how she sees herself, it seems like we can draw some inference that Talla sees herself as a blue chicken (well, bird, given Alethi use of the word). Why would an honorspren see itself as a bird?
I was kind of confused by this at first, since it sounded like Rlain had hoped to be able to see any visions at all. But maybe it’s just saying that, while Rlain can see visions given to himself directly, he also hoped that he could share in visions given to Renarin? I don’t actually remember anything on-page about Rlain’s surgebinding or Radiant abilities with his new spren bond, which is probably why I was confused about what he can/can’t do.
Why would the sibling block out the rhythms of roshar? She plays her song, of honor and cultivation, but is that not compatible with the other rhythms (that themselves are also presumably shaped by the tones of Honor and Cultivation)? The only thing I can come up with is that Rlain is Radiant now, and there’s some localized effect that lets Radiants access and use Towerlight, that the Connection involved in that effect is somehow swamping out the latent Connection of a singer to Roshar that lets him hear the rhythms. But I’m not sure if Connection works that way, with a strong one being able to swamp out a weaker one…